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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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The Spanish "Don" [parsing of Don Javier Castillo in 'The Alamo'] |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | BTW Gunnar, had you bothered to put aside your agenda and actually pay attention to the discussion. You would have found the following Don Javier Castillo is currently parsed as Don /Javier/ Castillo the starting point. Enry provided documentation which considered adequate to make it Don Javier/ Castillo, as I noted his documentation is not definitive but it is adequate in my opinion. So my position on this is totally consistent with what my position has always been relative to parsing of names. So kindly keep your obvious and insulting agenda to yourself and stop trying to talk about apples when we are discussing oranges. How much more insulting can you possibly get. Skip  | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,677 |
| | Posted: | | | | No point in trying to continue a discussion with someone who cannot tell names from fruits...
Your agenda is quite clear - you won't discuss anything that might uncover inconsistencies in your reasoning. I won't tell you what I'd call that kind of behavior. That would be insulting... | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | The only inconsistent reasoning here is yours, Gunnar, constantly that is the one thing about you that is consistent; predictably so.
Done here to, there is nothing of further use to assist Enry.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: August 22, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 1,807 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
If you subscribe to the "enter what you see - make no interpretation" doctrine, then this should be entered as "Don/Javier/Castillo".
Do you see slashes on screen?   | | | | -- Enry |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Everybody's a comedian.  Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Typical Skipism to avoid discussing something 
In order to know that something is a honorific title you need to know something about the particular culture, right? And you did say, in an otherwise unrelated matter, that we should be able to enter data inte DVD Profiler without knowing how other cultures handle things, right?
Doesn't that mean that you are now contradicting yourself? I see where you are coming from Gunnar but, no, Skip is not contradicting himself. Let me see if I can help here. In the 'FRANCOIS/François' debate, Skip believes we are changing the data based on culture. Simply put, 'C = c', 'Ç = ç' but 'C' does not equal 'ç'. Changing 'C' to 'ç', in Skip's mind, changes the data. For name parsing, we are not changing the data. An on screen credit of 'Don Javier Castillo' can equal 'Don Javier Castillo/ /' or 'Don/Javier/Castillo' or Don Javier/ /Castillo' or 'Don/ /Javier Castillo'. The data remains the same no matter how you parse it. I hope I explained that correctly. I am sure Skip will correct me if I was wrong, but that is how I see his position on the two matters. Edit: Had to edit one portion as the 'not equals' symbol didn't translate.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Certainly close enough for government work.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,677 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
I see where you are coming from Gunnar but, no, Skip is not contradicting himself. In my opinion he is. I think you are both looking too closely at the details. It's not relevant if it's data being changed or parsing being changed. The point is that in the first discussion Skip said that you should be able to enter the data without knowing the culture. In this thread he says you should take the culture into consideration since Don is a honorific title in the Hispanic countries. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 3,830 |
| | Posted: | | | | to complicate matters even further: In Italy, ... It is also used to refer to a priest, or, less commonly, to monksIn North America, Don is sometimes used as an honorific for a Mafia crime boss...At Oxford and Cambridge universities, members of the academic staff are sometimes referred to as a Don ..source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_(honorific) | | | | Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
In my opinion he is. I think you are both looking too closely at the details. It's not relevant if it's data being changed or parsing being changed. For you it is not relevant. For Skip, it is. That is the crux of his argument. While you may not agree with him, that is how he sees it. Quote:
The point is that in the first discussion Skip said that you should be able to enter the data without knowing the culture. In this thread he says you should take the culture into consideration since Don is a honorific title in the Hispanic countries. This is where you are misreading him. He didn't say you should, he said you could...with documentation. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,677 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
In my opinion he is. I think you are both looking too closely at the details. It's not relevant if it's data being changed or parsing being changed.
For you it is not relevant. For Skip, it is. That is the crux of his argument. While you may not agree with him, that is how he sees it.
Quote:
The point is that in the first discussion Skip said that you should be able to enter the data without knowing the culture. In this thread he says you should take the culture into consideration since Don is a honorific title in the Hispanic countries.
This is where you are misreading him. He didn't say you should, he said you could...with documentation. You're right, I didn't put that correctly. However, in the other thread he was totally opposed to using cultural information, in this thread he says it's ok to do so. Ergo, a contradiction. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Not a contradiction at all, in the context of the argument. Gunnar you are far too intent on your gotcha game and you bring in apples to discussion about oranges, These are too entirely different issues, with only one common thread, in some cases culture can be involved, but that is not really relevant to the issue. The bottom line issue is what is or is not an honorific, in this case, and that is not really a cultural issue in this case. If the name honorific is Joe, and it can verified that it is an honorific, the fact that Joe might be an honorific in Greek is completely irrelevant, Just as the fact that Don is an honorific in the latin culture is not relevant, the only question is "Is it an honorific?" or is Don a shortened version of Donald.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,677 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Skip (from the other thread): Quote:
Your choice IS based on cultural preference. my choice is based ONLY on what appears ON SCREEN. I don't care where it comes from. Quoting Skip (in this thread): Quote:
in some cases culture can be involved So at least we seem to have gone from "never" to "sometimes". Never - when it comes to "decapitalization", sometimes - when it comes to name parsing. Call it a "gotcha game" if that feels better. I call it being inconsistent. To me, if the one case is acceptable with proper documentation, the other should be as well. That's consistency, in my opinion. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Again you are attempting to play Gotcha and not reading and understanding what I am saying. The fact that Don is an honorific in Latin Culture is NOT relevant in any way. The only thing that is, is can we reasonably determine that is iis an HONORIFIC REGARDLESS of culture, it has absolutely NO bearing on Profiler at all. No matter how much you try there is n absolutely no change nor any inconsistency in my comments. You are definitely demonstrating something, Gunnar and i am sad to say it is not very attractive.
You are not demonstrating even the most basic level of comprehension. Sorry, guy, that is not in any way an attack, it is an observatiuon and one that deeply saddens me.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
You're right, I didn't put that correctly. However, in the other thread he was totally opposed to using cultural information, in this thread he says it's ok to do so. Ergo, a contradiction. He was opposed to it in that thread because, to him, changing 'C' to 'ç' changes the data and goes against the, "with names and roles listed exactly as they are in the credits," portion of the rules. When it comes to name parsing, there is no rule that says '1 2 3' equals '1/2/3'. If you can document that it should be '1 2/ /3', Skip is fine with that because the data isn't changed. I don't know how else to explain it so this will be my final attempt.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Exactly right, Unicus and i am with you.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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