Quoting Katatonia:

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I don't especially like either candidate.

However, I was going for McCain...until he chose Sarah Palin. Now? You couldn't pay me to vote for him. I think many of you can guess why that is so...

I can honestly say I didn't see the whole wolf thing coming.  I was expecting something more along the lines that she's just completely unqualified for national office.  Doh. 

Quoting mdnitoil:

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Quoting Katatonia:

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I don't especially like either candidate.

However, I was going for McCain...until he chose Sarah Palin. Now? You couldn't pay me to vote for him. I think many of you can guess why that is so...

I can honestly say I didn't see the whole wolf thing coming.  I was expecting something more along the lines that she's just completely unqualified for national office.  Doh. 

OK. please take my next line as questions, I have no political axe to grind, I'm interested.

WRT SP. Midnitoil questions whther SP is qualified for the VP position. I understand that SP is "running" a state. OK, I accept there is a large step up from state to country.

So I look at JMc & BO: they are senators; are they any more or any less qualified to run the country, surely it could be argued that they are actuallly less qualified than SP because they've never actually had to run anything??


Please discuss.....

Quoting Katatonia:

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Quoting Mole:

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Are you saying that you are anti hunting, and that SP is, as I understand, of the "hunting" persuasion?

I'm not against hunting. I am against slaughterous aerial-hunting and her offering a price per "fresh paw". Shooting 20+ baby wolf cubs in the head isn't exactly what I would call "hunting". Sorry, but I cannot vote for someone like that.

How about the fact that Alaska is overrun with wolves because of the Endangered Species act.  When you don't allow hunting you have to thin out the numbers to prevent disease, predation on non-game animals, and even attack on people.  Why do you think they reintroduced wolves to Yellowstone and up in northern Wisconsin, among other places?  Without natural predators, the deer population exploded, causing mass starvation in winter, and diseased herds due to overpopulation pressures.

Quoting Katatonia:

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You could make the same argument for humanity and all it's effects on nature. I don't deny the facts you've mentioned, but there are other ways to deal with the problem besides using machine guns from airplanes. That is not hunting, and it's certainly not heroic or something to brag about. And shooting 20+ wolf cubs in the heads? Simply barbaric.

Of course it's not hunting...it's called population control.

I'd call headshots very humane. Would you prefer poisoning which is not only painful but would risk killing other animals? They could try trapping and relocation, but where could they be relocated where they wouldn't cause the same problem? It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation unfortunately.

Quoting 8ballMax:

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Of course it's not hunting...it's called population control.

I'd call headshots very humane. Would you prefer poisoning which is not only painful but would risk killing other animals? They could try trapping and relocation, but where could they be relocated where they wouldn't cause the same problem? It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation unfortunately.

You're entitled to your opinion, but that doesn't necessarily make it right or the best method. We don't shoot strays in animal shelters in the heads as a viable means of population control. Does that mean the methods used there are inhumane? I wonder. Our methods for human execution in this country are either humane or they aren't, depending on who you ask. The same applies here too.

You guys can discuss the issue more all you want, but honestly I'm not interested in arguing the point further as I can see it getting ugly soon, and let's face it we're probably not going to be changing anyone's mind here. I merely entered this thread to voice my standpoint on whom I'm voting for (Obama), and why McCain lost my support after choosing Palin. Everyone here is rightly entitled to their viewpoint, no matter who they support in the election.

Quoting Mole:

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and on a lighter note  "Viva Emptiness"!

Excellent album Mole!

And anyone wondering about that one, can check out www.katatonia.com

Quoting Mole:

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I remember that the Swedish company Volvo had a policy (at one time) of always having the sidelights lit, but thought that this had died out.

It is not - they still do it. In fact, I don't think it is possible to buy a new car in Sweden or Denmark without this feature, simply because it is mandatory to have Daytime Running Lights (DRL). Most cars just use low beams for this which then come on with the ignition, but the requirement for the DRL is lower than that for the low beams, which Volvos sidelights meet.

I don't remember how long this has been mandatory in Sweden - longer than I remember, and as far as I remember, even the Volvo Amazons from the 60's had DRL - maybe they started it when they switched to driving on the right? In Denmark, the law has been in effect since October 1st 1990 (from which date seatbelts were also mandatory in the back seat). The result was a decrease in accidents of about 10%...

Besides Sweden and Denmark, I know that DRL has been mandatory in Austria since 2005, and it also is in Norway and Finland. In Poland low beams are to be used between October 1st and March 1st, and in Italy and Hungary it is mandatory outside city limits.

If the EU commission gets their way, DRL will be mandatory in the entire EU in 2011.

In fact, it is debated if DRL should also be mandatory for bicycles in Denmark. I'm not sure if it will help anything, as danish cyclists generally disconnect the brain as they mount their bike... 

EDIT: The reason that you think that is had died out is possibly that Volvo, if I remember correctly, disconnected the DRL on cars that were exported to the US. Apparantly, they sold more cars "over there" after they did this than before...

Quoting Mole:

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Quoting Dr. Killpatient:

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From my understanding, heat radiation from the road can blur the outlines of cars making them harder to see (the mirage effect) and the headlights help counter that.

Ah, I hadn't thought of that.......we don't get that much heat over here!!!!   We could give you some rain though...  

edit: yes, giving it some thought, I can see the sense in that.....certainly the roads with the signs were in the "hotter" bits of the south west!

Good call, thanks

Would you like some?

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