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    Invelos Forums->General: General Discussion Page: 1 2 3  Previous   Next
Has the Reputation System gotten out of hand?
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantkahless
TaH pagh taHbe'!
Registered: March 14, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Germany Posts: 17,804
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Quoting Katatonia:
Quote:
[...]I do wish we would get more than 5 votes per day to give out, as I usually run out every day with all the posts on the forum!


I'd like to change my available red ones into additional green ones...
Thorsten
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorVoltaire53
Missed again!
Registered: March 13, 2007
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FWIW the only thing I think could be improved is making it more obvious/easy to Positive vote on contributions as these are something I think are often more deserving than some of the posts... and very often more deserving than getting a Positive just for voting Yes on a contribution.
It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorDJ Doena
Registered: May 1, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Quoting Voltaire53:
Quote:
FWIW the only thing I think could be improved is making it more obvious/easy to Positive vote on contributions as these are something I think are often more deserving than some of the posts... and very often more deserving than getting a Positive just for voting Yes on a contribution.

I'd rather seperate the contribution system from the forum system. IMHO arrows are for behaviour in the forums. A good contributor isn't necessarily a polite forum user and vice versa.
Karsten
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
NON-STEPFORD PROFILER
Registered: September 30, 2008
Reputation: Highest Rating
Canada Posts: 1,805
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Being new around here and all, I never even really paid attention to the Reputation System, but after reading this, I clicked on my little star to see if in the six or seven posts I've made, anyone had rated me.

I got a little red arrow for thanking a forum member for helping me out. So hells yeah it needs to be changed!!      (It was Skip I was thanking... maybe that explains it?  ) As much as I'm kidding and don't particularly care, when I saw the little red arrow, for the first few seconds I was annoyed. I don't see how me saying a genuine thanks to someone who went out of their way to help me out could be preceived as negativity, but who knows, maybe I really pissed someone off. 

Reputation systems are always tricky. No matter where you go, there are always going to be people that abuse it simply for the sake of abusing it. I do think the idea of making someone leave a comment if voting negative will help reduce needless abuse of the system, but other than that, I wouldn't have any inspiring brain flashes to fix it. It is a decent idea though, and I can't imagine would take more than a few minutes to impliment.
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
 Last edited: by Merrik
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorPantheon
Registered: March 14, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United Kingdom Posts: 1,819
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This is always a very touchy subject, because one person's sensitivity is different from the next.

As an example, in the recent Prop 8 thread I gave out some red arrows for statements I found offensive. I admitted this fact in that thread and I subsequently got a red arrow for saying I had given out some myself.

Giving a red arrow because you disagree with someone else giving one is a definite abuse of the voting system.

But it does depend on your viewpoint and your personal circumstances.

Purely as an example:
Here's two statements:

1. I disagree with your lifestyle on religious grounds.

2. I disagree with your lifestyle because it is abnormal, aberrant and evil.

Both these statements are personal opinions. Both can be construed as freedom of speech etc.

However, TO ME statement 2 is highly offensive and would get a red arrow. Whereas Statement 1 is NOT offensive and would not get a red arrow.
In principal BOTH statements are saying the exact same thing - it's the WORDING that's important here.

I can honestly say I have NEVER given a red arrow because I simply disagreed with the poster's opinion; But ONLY if i have found the manner in which that opinion was expressed to be offensive.

And....as for the person who gave Merrik a red arrow for thanking Skip...you should be ashamed of yourself!!!!
 Last edited: by Pantheon
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorsurfeur51
Since July 3, 2003
Registered: March 29, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
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Quoting Pantheon:
Quote:
This is always a very touchy subject, because one person's sensitivity is different from the next.

As an example, in the recent Prop 8 thread I gave out some red arrows for statements I found offensive. I admitted this fact in that thread and I subsequently got a red arrow for saying I had given out some myself.

Giving a red arrow because you disagree with someone else giving one is a definite abuse of the voting system.

But it does depend on your viewpoint and your personal circumstances.

...

I can honestly say I have NEVER given a red arrow because I simply disagreed with the poster's opinion; But ONLY if i have found the manner in which that opinion was expressed to be offensive.

And....as for the person who gave Merrik a red arrow for thanking Skip...you should be ashamed of yourself!!!!


I totally agree with you. So, if people were obliged to write why they find that  a post deserves a red arrow, many of those bad marks would disappear. For example, I would like to know why my post on previous page quoting goblinsdoitall deserved one.
Images from movies
 Last edited: by surfeur51
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantpauls42
Reg: 31/01/2003
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting Pantheon:
Quote:
This is always a very touchy subject, because one person's sensitivity is different from the next.

As an example, in the recent Prop 8 thread I gave out some red arrows for statements I found offensive. I admitted this fact in that thread and I subsequently got a red arrow for saying I had given out some myself.

Giving a red arrow because you disagree with someone else giving one is a definite abuse of the voting system.

But it does depend on your viewpoint and your personal circumstances.

Purely as an example:
Here's two statements:

1. I disagree with your lifestyle on religious grounds.

2. I disagree with your lifestyle because it is abnormal, aberrant and evil.

Both these statements are personal opinions. Both can be construed as freedom of speech etc.

However, TO ME statement 2 is highly offensive and would get a red arrow. Whereas Statement 1 is NOT offensive and would not get a red arrow.
In principal BOTH statements are saying the exact same thing - it's the WORDING that's important here.

I can honestly say I have NEVER given a red arrow because I simply disagreed with the poster's opinion; But ONLY if i have found the manner in which that opinion was expressed to be offensive.

And....as for the person who gave Merrik a red arrow for thanking Skip...you should be ashamed of yourself!!!!


I agree with this as well.

I'll also add that I never bother about the Red's I get so I don't bother reporting them.
Paul
 Last edited: by pauls42
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
Strength Through Unity
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
Germany Posts: 6,730
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Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
For example, I would like to know why my post on previous page quoting goblinsdoitall deserved one.

Couldn't tell you.
I found your posting quite amusing.
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


Registrant since 05/22/2003
 Last edited: by Lewis_Prothero
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorBerak
Bibamus morieundum est!
Registered: May 10, 2007
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Quoting pauls42:
Quote:
Quoting Pantheon:
Quote:
This is always a very touchy subject, because one person's sensitivity is different from the next.

As an example, in the recent Prop 8 thread I gave out some red arrows for statements I found offensive. I admitted this fact in that thread and I subsequently got a red arrow for saying I had given out some myself.

Giving a red arrow because you disagree with someone else giving one is a definite abuse of the voting system.

But it does depend on your viewpoint and your personal circumstances.

Purely as an example:
Here's two statements:

1. I disagree with your lifestyle on religious grounds.

2. I disagree with your lifestyle because it is abnormal, aberrant and evil.

Both these statements are personal opinions. Both can be construed as freedom of speech etc.

However, TO ME statement 2 is highly offensive and would get a red arrow. Whereas Statement 1 is NOT offensive and would not get a red arrow.
In principal BOTH statements are saying the exact same thing - it's the WORDING that's important here.

I can honestly say I have NEVER given a red arrow because I simply disagreed with the poster's opinion; But ONLY if i have found the manner in which that opinion was expressed to be offensive.

And....as for the person who gave Merrik a red arrow for thanking Skip...you should be ashamed of yourself!!!!


I agree with this as well.

I'll also add that I never bother about the Red's I get so I don't bother reporting them.


I agree also (very well put Pantheon)...   
Berak

It's better to burn out than to fade away!
True love conquers all!
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributor?
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Registered: March 14, 2007
Posts: 3,830
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Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
For example, I would like to know why my post on previous page quoting goblinsdoitall deserved one.

Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
and I really don't care about those arrows ( )
Maybe you did ask for one?
Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorsynnerman
Take me with you. Please.
Registered: March 13, 2007
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I agree with the idea that we can give a reason for the arrows.  I've only used the arrow system maybe 8 times since it was implemented and it was split 50/50 in green and red.  For the red, I really wanted to explain why (for example, I saw an early political post about 2 months ago that seemed to be started only to get into a flamewar - the last thing this place really needs).  But without the explanation, it looks like I only used it because I disagreed with the political point.  After I realized that it would have no effect, I just stayed out of the general forum.  The whole point of the arrow system isn't to simply to show disagreement or agreement, but to point out to the mods who is a help to the forums (equalling stars) and who is a hinderence.  Since we've yet to see anyone actually punished with a negative rating, the whole thing seems to be more of a prestige element than an actual "reputation" system.  That is fine, but it is not what is set out to be.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantkdh1949
Have Gun Will Travel
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
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I think some people are so insecure and so narrow minded that they give out red arrows whenever some particular person posts.  There wasn't anything in Surfeur's posts (either one of them on the first page) that anyone could honestly give a red arrow to.  Maybe someone just threw him a red arrow because he dared to post or they didn't like what he's said in the past.  He probably thinks I've sent a few his way because I have been so critical of him in public.  But that's where I criticize people -- in public -- not hidden behind some unidentifiable red arrow.

I know I've gotten a few red arrows for posts where the only thing I've done is mention someone's name -- neither to praise or condemn that person, just refer to him in the post.  This usually happens if I mention Skip's name.

No one has mentioned it before (that I recall) but I think people are often to free to give out GREEN arrows, too.  I think they should be given out for some good reason, not just because I agree with the statement someone makes.  Like I agree with giving green arrows when someone makes a good suggestion, helps another user, or comes to the defense of someone who has been abused in one post or another.  In short, I don't think the Rep System is benefitted by over use of EITHER Red or Green arrows.

Those few contributors who have gotten more than two stars have, IMO, earned them by what they've contributed to improving Profiler or making these forums more worthwhile -- not just because they've expressed popular sentiments or attacked this week's whipping boy.
Another Ken (not Ken Cole)
Badges? We ain't got no badges. We don't need no badges. I don't have to show you any stinking badges.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLord Of The Sith
Registered: March 17, 2007
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Quoting kdh1949:
Quote:
I think some people are so insecure and so narrow minded that they give out red arrows whenever some particular person posts.  There wasn't anything in Surfeur's posts (either one of them on the first page) that anyone could honestly give a red arrow to.  Maybe someone just threw him a red arrow because he dared to post or they didn't like what he's said in the past.  He probably thinks I've sent a few his way because I have been so critical of him in public.  But that's where I criticize people -- in public -- not hidden behind some unidentifiable red arrow.

I know I've gotten a few red arrows for posts where the only thing I've done is mention someone's name -- neither to praise or condemn that person, just refer to him in the post.  This usually happens if I mention Skip's name.

No one has mentioned it before (that I recall) but I think people are often to free to give out GREEN arrows, too.  I think they should be given out for some good reason, not just because I agree with the statement someone makes.  Like I agree with giving green arrows when someone makes a good suggestion, helps another user, or comes to the defense of someone who has been abused in one post or another.  In short, I don't think the Rep System is benefitted by over use of EITHER Red or Green arrows.

Those few contributors who have gotten more than two stars have, IMO, earned them by what they've contributed to improving Profiler or making these forums more worthwhile -- not just because they've expressed popular sentiments or attacked this week's whipping boy.


I am giving you a green for this post.  I honestly believe that I have been the voice of reason I was setting out to be, because of what you wrote.  Also surfer have a green on me to make up for the erroneous red.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorsurfeur51
Since July 3, 2003
Registered: March 29, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
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Quoting Lord Of The Sith:
Quote:
  Also surfer have a green on me to make up for the erroneous red.


Thanks for that. But I didn't gave that example to have a green one, just to show that the system doesn't work properly.

As I have already said, I don't care about red arrows, as I got so many without any effect on my reputation.

The latest one is also interesting :



As the first image is from front cover, and the second is the logo we find on back covers, my question was relevant, but probably didn't please to somebody...

And it's not for another green... 

Images from movies
 Last edited: by surfeur51
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantkdh1949
Have Gun Will Travel
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
As the first image is from front cover, and the second is the logo we find on back covers, my question was relevant, but probably didn't please to somebody...

One could argue over whether or not it's relevant -- or how relevant if it is -- but it should be clear to anyone that there is nothing in that post to warrant a red arrow.
Another Ken (not Ken Cole)
Badges? We ain't got no badges. We don't need no badges. I don't have to show you any stinking badges.
DVD Profiler user since June 15, 2001
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
Strength Through Unity
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
Germany Posts: 6,730
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Quoting kdh1949:
Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
As the first image is from front cover, and the second is the logo we find on back covers, my question was relevant, but probably didn't please to somebody...

One could argue over whether or not it's relevant -- or how relevant if it is -- but it should be clear to anyone that there is nothing in that post to warrant a red arrow.

Agreed with Ken,
obviously Surfeur has the same problem as Skip, which is that some users will give red arrows for anything he writes. This, of course, is abuse of the reputation system and should be banned.
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


Registrant since 05/22/2003
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