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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Include Bonus Features when part of the Overview or not? |
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| Author |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 3,436 |
| | Posted: | | | | Given the complications user interpretation may bring and a rule clarification would create I have to agree with the OP. Quoting Dr Pavlov: Quote:
Well first we have to assume that your interpretation is completely correct, surfeur and it is not as has been explained by Unicus, Pete and myself. I hate to put it this way, pal, but you simply have nothing with which to offer guidance, you can create an interpretation but that does not mean that is a correct interpretation. Somehow I feel the urge to bookmark this post... | | | Achim [諾亞信； Ya-Shin//Nuo], a German in Taiwan.
Registered: May 29, 2000 (at InterVocative) |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
Quoting Dr. Killpatient:
Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
This part is not included in the overview. It just follows the text of the overview in the same paragraph. For what is expected of an overview by the rules, just read exclusions...
There is no break in there so you can't assume it's separated.
I agree... there is no indication there that they meant it to be anything but part of the overview. When you have a continuous paragraph like that you can not pick and choose what part of it you use and what part you do not. To play devil's advocate, there is nothing in the rules that allows us that freedom. The rules explicitly tell us never to include extra features, and unlike reviews there is no exception if they are incorporated into the text of the overview. Of course that exception should have been there, but that's not the point. You all seem to be jumping on Surfeur for pointing out something that is 100% right: as the rules currently stand we are not allowed to include extra features regardless of where they appear in the overview. There is no room for interpretation, the rules simply say "never", no "but"s no "unless"s - just "never". The arguments that they are part of the same paragraph or not are also irrelevant, because again the rules don't make that exception, like they do just one line above for reviews. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | The rules also says to take the overview from the back cover exactly... so if they are printed within the overview and you remove them you are breaking that rule. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | As has been explained, there is room for interpretation. If anything, the rule is contradictory. One part tells us to copy the overview 'exactly', while the next tells us to leave things out. A simple rule change, similar to the one below, should solve this.
Unless they are incorporated into the text of the overview on the case, never include the following items in overviews:
Taglines
Reviews
Extra features
Hyperlinks or other HTML
Line-break hyphens should never be included | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 19, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 6,018 |
| | Posted: | | | | @ Pete: That would ultimately depend on your definition of "Overview"...  @ Unicus: Absolutely agree!  | | | | Last edited: by dee1959jay |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 1,414 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
As has been explained, there is room for interpretation. If anything, the rule is contradictory. One part tells us to copy the overview 'exactly', while the next tells us to leave things out. A simple rule change, similar to the one below, should solve this.
Unless they are incorporated into the text of the overview on the case, never include the following items in overviews:
Taglines
Reviews
Extra features
Hyperlinks or other HTML
Line-break hyphens should never be included I'd get behind that. | | | | "This movie has warped my fragile little mind." |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Dr. Killpatient: Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
This part is not included in the overview. It just follows the text of the overview in the same paragraph. For what is expected of an overview by the rules, just read exclusions...
There is no break in there so you can't assume it's separated. For me, an overview is a general description of the story of the movie, with many possible different forms. Rules also give a meaning to what must be found in overviews with a list of exclusion, among which we find extra features. Overview doesn't just mean "the paragraphs that are written on the back cover". So, in this case, we have in the same paragraph an overview followed by a list of extra features, even if there is no graphic break between them. For those who reproach me to give my opinion, I want to precise that this is a poll where everybody is requested to say what he thinks. I have absolutely no intention to consider me as a guidance for anybody. I just say how I see things. And I hardly understand all those hateful comments towards me, even if I learned to live with them on those forums. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: July 31, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,506 |
| | Posted: | | | | Whether or not I agree with surfeur's opinion, I do value it & thank him for posting his views. As he says, it is is a poll & everyone is entitled to his/her vote.  |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
And I hardly understand all those hateful comments towards me, even if I learned to live with them on those forums.
Maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with your attitude towards them? If you are going to make comments like, "Funny to see our temple guardians violate the rules when they do not agree with them," you have to expect some comments in return.  The fact remains that I strongly disagree with some of the rules but apply them strictly though I would prefer guides, and, on the contrary, I see those who tell me that my attitude sabotages the online database do what they want when they want. Rules say never include extra feature in a list of exceptions to the "Copy the overview from the back of the DVD case exactly as written". There is no room for interpretation. You consider that this exception is contradictory, but you promote the same contradiction for Line-break hyphens, when you write : Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
As has been explained, there is room for interpretation. If anything, the rule is contradictory. One part tells us to copy the overview 'exactly', while the next tells us to leave things out. A simple rule change, similar to the one below, should solve this.
Unless they are incorporated into the text of the overview on the case, never include the following items in overviews:
# Taglines
# Reviews
# Extra features
# Hyperlinks or other HTML
# Line-break hyphens should never be included
Where is consistency ? | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,917 |
| | Posted: | | | | Surfeur, my personal opinion is to exclude them but my interpretation of the rules states to include them as the "exact" rule is more dominant to the exclude rule.
I'm getting a headache trying to wrap my mind around the contradiction and explain it at the same time. I think I'll bow out of this conversation until a ruling is made. | | | | Last edited: by Dr. Killpatient |
| | Registered: July 31, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,506 |
| | Posted: | | | | The "No" voter was kind enough to change his vote because of this thread. |
| | Registered: December 13, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 334 |
| | Posted: | | | | While most of the people posting seem to agree that it should be included, the results of the pole so far, indicate a far smaller margin. Interesting. BTW: If any of you want to see a REALLY tight race: http://www.invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=viewtopic&topicID=363760&messageID=955747#M955747 The Yes=vote wasn't me. No, really. Honestly. Okay, it was.  |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Where is consistency ? I could explain it but, if I do, I could get hammered for trying to 'be a teacher'. Since it is a no win for me, I will just let alone. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
Where is consistency ?
I could explain it but, if I do, I could get hammered for trying to 'be a teacher'. Since it is a no win for me, I will just let alone. I'm with you, unicus, wasting my breath. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
Where is consistency ?
I could explain it but, if I do, I could get hammered for trying to 'be a teacher'... In fact, I would like to see your explanation. How can you logically write (in term of text analysis) that "exactly as written" is more important than "never include extra features" and less important than "never include Line-break hyphens", though both are in the same list, both with no special indications. I agree that we must not include line-breaks hyphens (as we should never include typos  ). I also think that to list features in a field which is made for the movie overview is just as incorrect. Last thing : If you think you are correct, why not propose the change in Rule Committee ? I will not do since I agree with the rule on this point (exclude features). | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: May 20, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
As has been explained, there is room for interpretation. If anything, the rule is contradictory. One part tells us to copy the overview 'exactly', while the next tells us to leave things out. A simple rule change, similar to the one below, should solve this.
Unless they are incorporated into the text of the overview on the case, never include the following items in overviews:
Taglines
Reviews
Extra features
Hyperlinks or other HTML
Line-break hyphens should never be included I think if you would move the line breaks section to the first paragraph of the rule, then the rule would probably make more since. Copy the overview from the back of the DVD case exactly as written, including capitalization of words exactly as shown on the back of the case. Separate all paragraphs with a blank line. If line break hyphens are part of the text, remove them. or something as such | | | | Last edited: by CharlieM |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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