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Message |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,245 |
| | Posted: | | | | But it seems you are applying the "Additional" in the company header to those listed underneath the company.
I only look at the individual credit, I don't even look at how the company itself is credited.
Now if the credit looked something like this.
"Additional Sound Editing by Skywalker Sound
<Name>
<Name>
<Name>"
Then no I wouldn't enter those names since it's unclear what they did.
However, if the credit looked something like below then I would credit the individuals listed.
"Additional Sound Editing by Skywalker Sound
Sound Editor <Name>
Supervising Sound Editor <Name>"
I would credit those two people. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | At this time, Cubby, we don't do Additional.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
|   | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Prof. Kingsfield: Quote:
At this time, Cubby, we don't do Additional. There we go!  |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | You don't do Additional, but other people are...especially in the Sound and SFX areas...so please, let's not use the global term "we don't" because, people do...some of them with dividers.
That being said, per the rules, we don't enter:
Co-Director
Co-Producers
Associate Producers
Co-Executive Producer
Associate Producer
Camera Operators
Unit Photographers
Co-Anything (sound)
Assistants (sound)
Associates (sound)
Interns (sound)
Set Decorator
Studio/Company Names
If you will notice, there isn't a single reference to 'additional'. I know, I know, we don't enter 'Additional Music by', but that is because, per the rules, we only enter the "composer of the film's Original Score." I know, I know, we don't enter 'Additionl Editing by', but that is because, per the rules, we only want "Principal Editors...credited together."
Once again, these are not Unit Crew. They are companies that were contracted to do SFX and VFX work on the film. Some specialize in pyro, others in digital, others in miniatures and others in prosthetics...such is the nature of the business. In my opinion, we track them all, or we track none of them. To only record one of them, based on the order they were credited, doesn't make any sense as the data is incomplete. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 906 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CubbyUps: Quote:
But it seems you are applying the "Additional" in the company header to those listed underneath the company.
<SNIP>
"Additional Sound Editing by Skywalker Sound
Sound Editor <Name>
Supervising Sound Editor <Name>"
To me, those two credits are the the same as 'Additional Sound Editor' and 'Additional Supervising Sound Editor' because of the header. After all, they are listed under it. By entering them as Sound Editor/Supervising Sound Editor, you are giving them a more important role in the movie than they have in my opinion. I agree with T!M here. Leave all the additionals out. | | | 
The colour of her eyes, were the colour of insanity |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
You don't do Additional, but other people are...especially in the Sound and SFX areas...so please, let's not use the global term "we don't" because, people do...some of them with dividers.
That being said, per the rules, we don't enter:
Co-Director
Co-Producers
Associate Producers
Co-Executive Producer
Associate Producer
Camera Operators
Unit Photographers
Co-Anything (sound)
Assistants (sound)
Associates (sound)
Interns (sound)
Set Decorator
Studio/Company Names
If you will notice, there isn't a single reference to 'additional'. I know, I know, we don't enter 'Additional Music by', but that is because, per the rules, we only enter the "composer of the film's Original Score." I know, I know, we don't enter 'Additionl Editing by', but that is because, per the rules, we only want "Principal Editors...credited together."
Once again, these are not Unit Crew. They are companies that were contracted to do SFX and VFX work on the film. Some specialize in pyro, others in digital, others in miniatures and others in prosthetics...such is the nature of the business. In my opinion, we track them all, or we track none of them. To only record one of them, based on the order they were credited, doesn't make any sense as the data is incomplete. Oh by all means let's be inconsistent, martian.  That is what causes half the trouble. Like I said, we don't do additional at this time. God forbid we be consistent on anything. let's just let everybody enter whatever they want, any way they want.  You like to claim it is not disallowed...neither is it specifically ALLOWED. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: December 10, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,004 |
| | Posted: | | | | We should be consistent if it makes sense, not just for consistency's sake. As other have explained, special effects are rather different than other cases. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | No, they aren't Ace.If we allow it for one, we allow it for ALL.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Prof. Kingsfield: Quote:
Oh by all means let's be inconsistent, martian. That is what causes half the trouble. Like I said, we don't do additional at this time. Please be so kind as to show me where I am being inconsistent. If the role, in the film credits, matches the role in the crew chart, I enter it. If it doesn't, I don't. Seems fairly consistent to me. Quote:
God forbid we be consistent on anything. let's just let everybody enter whatever they want, any way they want. You like to claim it is not disallowed...neither is it specifically ALLOWED. Actually, it is. VFX Supervisor is specifically allowed. SFX Supervisor is specifically allowed. You like to claim that we do not enter them, but the rules do not back you up and quite a few people...myself included...are entering them. The genie is out of the bottle and, unless you are going to go and reaudit all those titles to remove the credits, it isn't going back in. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | You enter ALL Additional? I don't think you do. And therein lies the inconsistency, sometimes you do, sometimes you don't, and it is all based on YOUR parsing, which many times allows a lot of horses out of the barn that should stay in there.
I don't claim anything about SFX Supervisor, this is about Additional nothing more. I am not one of those who claims that SFX is disallowed because of SFX, I see Special Effects.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | As for reauditing titles, that will come in good time and unless their rules change they will be removed, Martian. You like to disallow intent based on your parsing, in favor of your own intent, which simply is no more valid than mine, in fact less so, since you weren't involved at that stage. Your parsing simply causes problems many times, more times than I can count. The biggest single reason the genie is out of the bottle is because users are not forthcoming or honest in their notes, they simply throw a bunch of data against the wall, without providing information as to the ACTUAL data.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: December 10, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,004 |
| | Posted: | | | | Weren't you the guy who wanted to add robotic effects supervisor? How is that consistent.
A movie can quite easily have multiple special effects supervisors with each one being in charge of a sequence or two, but that's not like being assistant special effect supervisor.
Think of it this way: Movies these days pretty much have directing, sound and cinematography throughout. Special effects, not so much. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Prof. Kingsfield: Quote:
You enter ALL Additional? I don't think you do. And therein lies the inconsistency, sometimes you do, sometimes you don't, and it is all based on YOUR parsing, which many times allows a lot of horses out of the barn that should stay in there. I enter what is allowed by the crew chart. Nothing more, nothing less. Quote:
As for reauditing titles, that will come in good time and unless their rules change they will be removed, Martian. And, unless the rules change, I will vote 'no'...as I am sure quite a few other people will as well. Quote:
You like to disallow intent based on your parsing, in favor of your own intent, which simply is no more valid than mine, in fact less so, since you weren't involved at that stage. You assume far too much as, unlike you, I have no intent. When I audit a title, I look at the crew role, then look at the chart. If they match, I enter them. If they don't, I don't. No intent, no agenda, nothing but data entry. Quote:
Your parsing simply causes problems many times, more times than I can count. The biggest single reason the genie is out of the bottle is because users are not forthcoming or honest in their notes, they simply throw a bunch of data against the wall, without providing information as to the ACTUAL data. Again, you assume far too much. I give full notes when I enter them and have not had a single one rejected. My acceptance rate, though my numbers are low, is near 99.9%. The genie is out of the bottle because, those of us who asked for this credit field, knew what we wanted to track. Since the rules allow it, when read without intent, we have been entering them since the day we got the field. You can generalize and cast aspersions all you want, but it isn't going to change anything. I'm sorry, but it isn't. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ace_of_Sevens: Quote:
Weren't you the guy who wanted to add robotic effects supervisor? How is that consistent.
A movie can quite easily have multiple special effects supervisors with each one being in charge of a sequence or two, but that's not like being assistant special effect supervisor.
Think of it this way: Movies these days pretty much have directing, sound and cinematography throughout. Special effects, not so much. QFT. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ace_of_Sevens: Quote:
A movie can quite easily have multiple special effects supervisors with each one being in charge of a sequence or two, but that's not like being assistant special effect supervisor. A movie can quite easily have multiple additional composers working on it, each supplying the music for a sequence or two. Same thing, but we still don't track those "additional music by" credits.  |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 1,414 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Quoting Prof. Kingsfield:
Quote:
At this time, Cubby, we don't do Additional.
There we go! Can we have this exchange bronzed, please? | | | | "This movie has warped my fragile little mind." |
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