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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3 4  Previous   Next
Howard Berger credit, How to credit?
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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Now did you even take a look at the picture kindly provided by CubbyUps?
Or are you simply trying to deny the obvious?

Of course, and in fact that is the only source I'm using in this discussion.


Quote:
Right above the credit for Mr. Berger you will find the name of his company listed as "SFX-Make-up by KNB EFX Group, Inc.". Otherwise the Divider that you wanted to enter wouldn't make sense at all.

Where on that screenshot does it make an association between Mr. Berger and KNB EFX Group, Inc.?  Nowhere.

As for a group divider, I surely wouldn't enter one based on the credits shown in the first post.

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We don't know what follows after the Berger credit. It could be a list of mold-makers, latex crew, prosthetic design or any number of different jobs in the SFX Make-up business.

I guess it will be up to the people who own it and care.
 Last edited: by ateo357
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting ateo357:
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I guess it will be up to the people who own it and care.

Or at least the people who vote on it.

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 Last edited: by scotthm
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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OK, since you are trying to deny the obvious:

KNB is the acronym for Kurtzman, Nicotero and Berger the owners of the company.

And which part of that screenshot tells you this?


Quote:
BTW you still haven't answered my questions.

That's because I've just been discussing what's visible on that list of credits.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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OK, since you are trying to deny the obvious:

KNB is the acronym for Kurtzman, Nicotero and Berger the owners of the company.

And which part of that screenshot tells you this?
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The screen shot tells me this also. But I have looked up, and read about KNB Effects Group.
And since we are on SFX company credits - Tiny Juggernaut is a company and not a person.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
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Quoting ateo357:
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And since we are on SFX company credits - Tiny Juggernaut is a company and not a person.

I'm glad to hear that.  I don't see Tiny Juggernaut in the screenshot from the OP, but I do see "FLAT EARTH", which I suppose is also an effects company.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting ateo357:
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And since we are on SFX company credits - Tiny Juggernaut is a company and not a person.

I'm glad to hear that.  I don't see Tiny Juggernaut in the screenshot from the OP, but I do see "FLAT EARTH", which I suppose is also an effects company.

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It isn't listed in this film. Just put it out there because there may be a few people involved in this thread that have contributed it as a person. (Without getting specific)
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
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(Screenshot from "Wanted")

A question to those that want to enter Howard Berger as SFX-Supervisor:

So just to get this straight:
According to your logic Dan Chuba and Rebecca Marie would get entered as "Executive Producers" here?

And if not. In how far is this different from the example in the OP?
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


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 Last edited: by Lewis_Prothero
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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And if not. In how far is this different from the example in the OP?

One difference is that the formatting is completely different, in that "VISUAL EFFECTS BY HAMMERHEAD PRODUCTIONS, INC." isn't divided into two distinct columns like the credits below it are.  In the screenshot in the OP this distinction doesn't exist.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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And if not. In how far is this different from the example in the OP?

One difference is that the formatting is completely different, in that "VISUAL EFFECTS BY HAMMERHEAD PRODUCTIONS, INC." isn't divided into two distinct columns like the credits below it are.  In the screenshot in the OP this distinction doesn't exist.

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According to your former post this would be irrelevant

Quote scotthm
Quote:
I don't think the online database wants to know what everyone's job was, it just wants to know how everyone is credited


The credit clearly says "Executive Producer". Please note the distinct difference to the Visual Effects Producer right above them.
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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The credit clearly says "Executive Producer". Please note the distinct difference to the Visual Effects Producer right above them.

There is no compulsion to include every person in the credits.  When one is not certain that they belong in the online database one may omit them.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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The credit clearly says "Executive Producer". Please note the distinct difference to the Visual Effects Producer right above them.

There is no compulsion to include every person in the credits.  When one is not certain that they belong in the online database one may omit them.

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Fully agree.

But would it be allowed to enter these two as "Executive Producers" if I wanted to do so?
And if not, should I go on a quest to find an example with an identical layout? (May take some time, but I'm sure I will find them)
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


Registrant since 05/22/2003
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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...But would it be allowed to enter these two as "Executive Producers" if I wanted to do so...


I''m not saying that I would do so, but based on the screenshot and invelos' rules - yes.

For example - Puppeteers are credited if the appear long after the Cast listing.

Or, I've seen Stunt people be eliminated despite being listed within the Cast grouping.

The rules do not care where in the credits Cast and Crew appear...

...except for Editors.

There are exceptions or credits that can be seen in different ways...and there always will be.
 Last edited: by Kathy
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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But would it be allowed to enter these two as "Executive Producers" if I wanted to do so?

Yes, it's allowed.  I think you would get a lot of "No" votes if you included the screenshot in your contribution notes.  The screeners would go with the flow.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
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Quoting scotthm:
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Yes, it's allowed.


OK then.
The value of the data is highly questionable, but at least your approach is consistent.

Sorry to insist, but for me it still makes no sense to shoehorn credits into data-fields that were not intended for these.

But I guess this just corresponds to (and probably even results from) the other big inconsistency in the crew section, in which we don't track location and unit data, but happily enter companies (which in fact are nothing more than hired, external unit-crews).
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


Registrant since 05/22/2003
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
Strength Through Unity
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Quoting Kathy:
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The rules do not care where in the credits Cast and Crew appear...


Correct,
nevertheless we should.

And what's the problem with putting the raw-data (credit) into its context?
- We (at least roughly) know what the data-field was intended for
- We have "The Rules" to give us guidance
- We have a credit that fits only 50%

If those missing 50% were coming from "The Rules" (Not in the list) the answer would be easy.
But just because its "only" contradicting the original intent of the data-field there's suddenly a big discussion whether this should be allowed.

I'm not even sure anymore how absurd the example would have to be. Should I go out and check for a "Director" credited somewhere deep in the bowels of some obscure VFX-company?

For DVD-Profiler we are data-typists, but we have brains and we shouldn't be afraid to use them.
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
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Quoting Lewis_Prothero:
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we have brains and we shouldn't be afraid to use them.

I think you're taking quite a leap of faith.


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Sorry to insist, but for me it still makes no sense to shoehorn credits into data-fields that were not intended for these.

For me it makes sense if we all have a solid foundation to work from, even if it's a little rough and uneven.

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